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<p>As for servers with IPMI. We're going to use HPE DL20 servers for an upcoming project. They are also rather short, can come with a 4-port NIC for four EC-masters and redundant power supply. As we mount most hardware in 19" racks anyway, they fit our requirements
nicely.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>best</p>
<p>Niko</p>
<p><br>
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<div class="x_PlainText">--<br>
Paul Scherrer Institute<br>
Dr. Niko Kivel</div>
<div class="x_PlainText">Forschungsstrasse 111<br>
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5232 Villigen PSI<br>
Switzerland<br>
<br>
phone: +41 56 310 2226<br>
email: niko.kivel@psi.ch</div>
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<div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Etherlab-users <etherlab-users-bounces@etherlab.org> on behalf of Mercado, Ronaldo (DLSLtd,RAL,LSCI) <ronaldo.mercado@diamond.ac.uk><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, February 22, 2021 10:23:34 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Sebastien BLANCHET'; 'etherlab-users@etherlab.org'<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Etherlab-users] What Hardware</font>
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<div class="PlainText">Thanks to Karl for asking. I find this thread very interesting.<br>
<br>
I can comment on the requirements of Digital I/O and Analogue I/O. I think that a standard server will be enough.
<br>
We have been using Dell servers (most recently the R340) that cost about £1200. We use the generic driver at 1 ms cycle rate.<br>
<br>
I don't have experience on SSI or serial using etherlab.<br>
Sebastien mentioned moxa and I can second that - for serial we use Moxa terminal servers, e.g. NPort 6650-32<br>
<br>
IPMI on a standard server is convenient for monitoring of the console. <br>
We enquired recently about Beckhoff IPCs that would support that. <br>
It seems we could use the Intel AMT technology of the more recent Intel chips. <br>
The advantage we see is the form factor of an IPC vs the deep rack-mounted server.<br>
I recently ordered one C6030-0060 with the 6th Generation Intel® Core i5 6500 to trial.<br>
<br>
I also find very interesting the link to the Xeon server from Thomas Krenn. <br>
The Dell servers are 600 mm deep and some equipment racks are not deep enough for them.
<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Ronaldo Mercado<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Etherlab-users <etherlab-users-bounces@etherlab.org> On Behalf Of Sebastien BLANCHET<br>
Sent: 16 February 2021 11:59<br>
To: etherlab-users@etherlab.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Etherlab-users] What Hardware<br>
<br>
Hi,<br>
<br>
1/<br>
IgH EtherCAT master supports any EtherCAT vendors because all EtherCAT devices follow a very precise standard imposed by the EtherCAT Technology Group.<br>
<br>
In practice (most) Beckhoff ELxxxx I/O modules are easy to use because they are designed to support only EtherCAT.<br>
<br>
If you buy I/O modules which are compatible with several fieldbuses (for example Beckhoff BKxxx series or WAGO 750 series which support CANopen, Modbus, EtherCAT, etc) you have to configure them with SDO start-up list before be able to use the PDO.<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/bus-terminals/bkxxxx-bus-coupler/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/bus-terminals/bkxxxx-bus-coupler/</a><br>
<br>
Example with Kollmorgen AKD (it is not a basic I/O module but it shows the TxPDO and RxPDO setup)
<a href="https://www.iram.fr/~blanchet/ethercat/akd/examples/">https://www.iram.fr/~blanchet/ethercat/akd/examples/</a><br>
<br>
If you use TwinCAT, then it it not a real problem because you can just click in the GUI to setup the SDO startup lists, but if you use IgH EtherCAT master, you have to write your own C code to define these SDO startup lists.<br>
<br>
<br>
List of Beckhoff couplers that I have tested<br>
---------------------------------------------<br>
- EK1100<br>
- EK1501-0010<br>
<br>
To convert copper to fiber I use<br>
- EK1521-0010<br>
- EK1122<br>
<br>
<br>
All these couplers work very well. They are plug-and-play, nothing to configure. You just need to use "ethercat alias" command to setup the wanted address on the EtherCAT bus.<br>
<br>
<br>
List of easy-to-use modules that I have tested<br>
---------------------------------------------------------<br>
- digital input: EL1xxx modules<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el1xxx-digital-input/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el1xxx-digital-input/</a><br>
- digital output: EL2xxx modules<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el2xxx-digital-output/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el2xxx-digital-output/</a><br>
- analog input EL3xxx modules<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el3xxx-analog-input/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el3xxx-analog-input/</a><br>
- analog output: EL4xxx modules<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el4xxx-analog-output/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el4xxx-analog-output/</a><br>
- position measurement module EL5xxx<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el5xxx-position-measurement/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el5xxx-position-measurement/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
List of difficult to use modules that I have tested with IgH EtherCAT<br>
master)<br>
---------------------------------------------------<br>
- Communication modules: EL6xxx<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el6xxx-communication/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el6xxx-communication/</a>.
<br>
I have tested EL6002 and EL6614. They work only in kernel mode.<br>
- Compact drive modules: EL7xxx<br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el7xxx-compact-drive-technology/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el7xxx-compact-drive-technology/</a><br>
I have tested EL7031. It work but you have to implement yourself the finite-state-machine in the software to stop the motor when you hit end switches.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
2/<br>
In Kernel mode, you can use only C (no C++). You cannot use neither libraries like libc nor floating-point instructions. So you have to split your application in several programs.<br>
<br>
In my application, I have chosen to run only in user mode because I wanted to use C++/Qt. So I cannot use neither serial-over-ethercat nor ethernet-over-ethercat in my application. So I use physical ports instead. I use Debian with a PREEMPT-RT Linux kernel.<br>
<br>
<br>
3/<br>
The main advantage of IPMI is the remote KVM (Keyboard Video and Mouse) You can do all maintenance operation from a remote location, including reinstalling the operating system, editing the BIOS settings, etc.<br>
<a href="https://www.servethehome.com/explaining-the-baseboard-management-controller-or-bmc-in-servers/">https://www.servethehome.com/explaining-the-baseboard-management-controller-or-bmc-in-servers/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
4/<br>
I agree: the main advantage of the IgH EtherCAT master is the free <br>
software. I use only free software in my application and in the tool <br>
chain, so that I can maintain myself my application for decades if needed.<br>
<br>
IgH EtherCAT master is a very good free software: the software runs very <br>
well, even on old computers with slow CPU and low memory. I use it since <br>
2011 and I do not have encountered bugs yet.<br>
But the community is still small (there is less and less messages on the <br>
mailing list) and there is not a lot of documentation. At the end the <br>
learning curve is steep.<br>
<br>
There are also some limitations:<br>
As far as I know, IgH EtherCAT master does not support all the EtherCAT <br>
features like TwinCAT does. In particular I think that <br>
File-Over-EtherCAT, ServoProfile-Over-Ethercat are missing. On the other <br>
hand Serial-Over-EtherCAT and Ethernet-Over-EtherCAT work but only in <br>
kernel mode.<br>
<br>
If you need an optimized Ethernet driver for EtherCAT that are not <br>
provided in the official IgH EtherCAT master release, you can get Gavin <br>
LAMBERT's unofficial patches for newer kernels. I use them for a couple <br>
of years and they work very well.<br>
<a href="https://sourceforge.net/u/uecasm/etherlab-patches/ci/default/tree/#read">https://sourceforge.net/u/uecasm/etherlab-patches/ci/default/tree/#read</a><br>
<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
---<br>
<br>
Sebastien BLANCHET<br>
<br>
Le 15/02/2021 à 22:39, Karl Zeilhofer a écrit :<br>
> Dear Sebastian,<br>
><br>
> thank you very much for your answers. They are very accurate and helpful.<br>
><br>
> On 2/15/21 6:49 PM, Sebastien BLANCHET wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> 1/<br>
>> For the EtherCAT IO, you can buy Beckhoff ELxxxx terminals<br>
>> because they work directly with IgH EtherCAT master.<br>
>> <a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/</a><br>
>><br>
>> For the coupler the standard EK1100 is very good. If you need to run<br>
>> over fiber optic, Beckhoff has also fiber optic model like EK1501<br>
> Currently I'm planning to use all IO terminals from Beckhoff. But I<br>
> would be glad, if the IGH EtherCAT master also supports other vendors of<br>
> EtherCAT components. What would be the difficulties there?<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> 2/<br>
>> For the RS232 interface<br>
>><br>
>> - The easier solution is to use physical serial port or USB-RS232<br>
>> adapters<br>
>><br>
>> - Beckhoff Serial-Over-EtherCAT module (EL6002) work only<br>
>> with TwinCAT or with IgH EtherCAT master in **KERNEL** mode.<br>
>> <br>
<a href="https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el6xxx-communication/el6002.html">https://www.beckhoff.com/en-us/products/i-o/ethercat-terminals/el6xxx-communication/el6002.html</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> It would be easier to drive your other I/O in user mode with the<br>
>> libethercat.so library, but maybe you can run one EtherCAT controller<br>
>> in kernel mode for the serial ports and the other one in user mode for<br>
>> the others I/O. I do not know if it works because I have never tried<br>
>> such a configuration.<br>
>><br>
>> - MOXA sells nice serial-over-ethernet adapter but their NPREAL driver<br>
>> is not compatible yet with PREEMPT-RT kernel, so you have to drive the<br>
>> serial port from another computer<br>
><br>
> Thanks for this, I've to investigate the disadvantages of Kernel mode<br>
> master.<br>
><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> 3/<br>
>> For cycle time between 1 and 10ms, you can use a PREEMPT-RT Linux<br>
>> kernel, and run your control program in user mode.<br>
>><br>
>> - For 10ms you can use the generic Ethernet driver<br>
>> - For 1ms you must use an optimized Ethernet driver (actually e1000,<br>
>> e1000e or r8169)<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> 4/<br>
>> You can use a PC desktop for the development but for the production an<br>
>> industrial or server computer is prefereable.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> The main advantage of Beckhoff IPC are<br>
>> - very robust<br>
>> - 24VDC power supply<br>
>> - very long lifecycle: you can buy exactly the same model for 10 years.<br>
>> - they can repair the IPC during 20 years.<br>
>><br>
>> The only drawback: they lack of IPMI for remote management.<br>
>> My prefered models are the C6920 or C6930 with the optional plug-in<br>
>> card slots.<br>
> Thanks for that tip.<br>
>><br>
>> If you need an IPMI interface for remote management, a compact<br>
>> Supermicro server with a Xeon-D processor is also an interesting option<br>
>> <br>
<a href="https://www.thomas-krenn.com/en/products/rack-server/1u-servers/intel-single-cpu/intel-single-cpu-ri1102-d.html">https://www.thomas-krenn.com/en/products/rack-server/1u-servers/intel-single-cpu/intel-single-cpu-ri1102-d.html</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
> IPMO is currently not needed, but the hardware looks very promising for<br>
> it's price.<br>
>><br>
>> 5/<br>
>> Beckhoff has a new product called "TwinCAT/BSD" that may interest you.<br>
>> It is TwinCAT + FreeBSD.<br>
>> <br>
<a href="https://download.beckhoff.com/download/document/ipc/embedded-pc/embedded-pc-cx/TwinCAT_BSD_en.pdf">https://download.beckhoff.com/download/document/ipc/embedded-pc/embedded-pc-cx/TwinCAT_BSD_en.pdf</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> I have never tried yet, but if I have to start a new project from<br>
>> scratch with EtherCAT, it would be a serious design option.<br>
><br>
> My main motivation for the IGH EtherCAT master is the free software in<br>
> the whole tool chain. No licensing, no end of support.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Thanks again,<br>
> Karl<br>
><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Regards,<br>
>> ---<br>
>> Sebastien BLANCHET<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Le 15/02/2021 à 16:26, Karl Zeilhofer a écrit :<br>
>>> Hello users of EtherLab!<br>
>>><br>
>>> We are planing a retrofit a control system in the industrial field with<br>
>>> EtherCAT components.<br>
>>><br>
>>> * 500 digital I/Os<br>
>>> * 4 Analog Inputs<br>
>>> * 15 Analog Outputs<br>
>>> * SSI Input<br>
>>> * Some 9.6kbaud RS232 ports<br>
>>><br>
>>> Cycle Time should be in the range of 1 to 10ms.<br>
>>><br>
>>> What hardware would you recommend?<br>
>>><br>
>>> I have an offer for a Beckhoff IPC for around 2.000¤ for an Core i7 <br>
with<br>
>>> 4 LAN ports.<br>
>>> Another offer is about 800¤ for a similar desktop system.<br>
>>><br>
>>> How critical is the decision for or against the supported Ethernet chip<br>
>>> sets (e1000, e1000e or r8169)? Would the generic driver be sufficient?<br>
>>><br>
>>> Kind regards,<br>
>>> Karl Zeilhofer<br>
>>><br>
<br>
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